Ubuntu-devel-discuss Digest, Vol 42, Issue 32

Anthony G Weitekamp

2010-05-19 00:30:57 UTC

You are surprised? Google makes its money by selling information. It
does not care how the information is obtained, just that it is. Stop
whining and accept the fact that Google, like any other commercial
search engine is spyware. Deal with or avoid it. Read the fine print
in your EULA.

Tony Weitekamp

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1. Re: SRWare Iron: Chromium without the data-mining (Ryan Oram)
2. Re: SRWare Iron: Chromium without the data-mining (Ryan Oram)
3. Re: SRWare Iron: Chromium without the data-mining (John Moser)
4. Re: SRWare Iron: Chromium without the data-mining (Joe Terranova)
5. Re: SRWare Iron: Chromium without the data-mining (Ryan Oram)
6. Re: Remove OO Draw from the default install (Bruno Girin)
7. Re: SRWare Iron: Chromium without the data-mining
(Jonathon Fernyhough)
8. Re: SRWare Iron: Chromium without the data-mining (Ryan Oram)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Tue, 18 May 2010 13:12:33 -0400
Subject: Re: SRWare Iron: Chromium without the data-mining
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
"Chrome Incognito Tracks Visited Sites"
http://www.lewiz.org/2010/05/chrome-incognito-tracks-visited-sites.html
This seems to be becoming a theme. As Chromium has much of the same
privacy issues as Chrome (SRWare Iron is made from Chromium and the
code is striped from Chromium), this "feature" is surely in Chromium
as well.
I find this completely unacceptable.
Thanks,
Ryan
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 18 May 2010 13:22:54 -0400
Subject: Re: SRWare Iron: Chromium without the data-mining
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

"Chrome Incognito Tracks Visited Sites"
http://www.lewiz.org/2010/05/chrome-incognito-tracks-visited-sites.html
This seems to be becoming a theme. As Chromium has much of the same
privacy issues as Chrome (SRWare Iron is made from Chromium and the
code is striped from Chromium), this "feature" is surely in Chromium
as well.
I find this completely unacceptable.
Thanks,
Ryan

The above seems to be an oversight on Google's part. But the fact that
it hasn't been fixed, despite being known for over a month, is a good
indicator that Google isn't too concerned about privacy...
Thanks,
Ryan
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Tue, 18 May 2010 13:30:40 -0400
Subject: Re: SRWare Iron: Chromium without the data-mining
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Shut up. You're whining like a raving politicized lune and nobody is
listening to your monologue.
Apply some critical thinking skills. It's a bug in a special mode of a
browser, a mode that doesn't store history/cookies. It's not (known to be)
sharing anything with the 'net, so it's innocuous as known. Nobody can
agree on if it even works; or if it does, if it works between sessions.
I suppose when a cloud goes in front of the sun you panic and look up to
check if the sun is dying.
"Chrome Incognito Tracks V...
The above seems to be an oversight on Google's part. But the fact that
it hasn't been fixed, despite being known for over a month, is a good
indicator that Google isn't too concerned about privacy...
Thanks, Ryan -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list
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Message: 4
Date: Tue, 18 May 2010 13:33:41 -0400
Subject: Re: SRWare Iron: Chromium without the data-mining
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Don't hold back, John. Tell us how you really feel.

Shut up.? You're whining like a raving politicized lune and nobody is
listening to your monologue.
Apply some critical thinking skills.? It's a bug in a special mode of a
browser, a mode that doesn't store history/cookies.? It's not (known to be)
sharing anything with the 'net, so it's innocuous as known.? Nobody can
agree on if it even works; or if it does, if it works between sessions.
I suppose when a cloud goes in front of the sun you panic and look up to
check if the sun is dying.
"Chrome Incognito Tracks V...
The above seems to be an oversight on Google's part. But the fact that
it hasn't been fixed, despite being known for over a month, is a good
indicator that Google isn't too concerned about privacy...
Thanks, Ryan -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list
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------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Tue, 18 May 2010 13:36:19 -0400
Subject: Re: SRWare Iron: Chromium without the data-mining
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Towards the end, everyone was picking up the bug.
Yes, it's a little detail. But it's one that can be be easily picked
up by any trojan or tracking software. It completely defeats the
purpose of the Incognito mode, which is to prevent any of this
information to be stored.
Thanks,
Ryan
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Tue, 18 May 2010 19:52:34 +0100
Subject: Re: Remove OO Draw from the default install
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"

On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 1:27 PM, Shane Fagan

Hey all,
I forgot to mention this at the session for default app selection but
can we remove Open Office Draw from the default ubuntu install? The
reasons are quite obvious it just isnt any good and I dont think any of
the regular users actually use it.

This probably deserves some discussion. I'm not a huge fan or
openoffice in general for various reasons but it seems to be the best
free software available for a wide audience (LaTeX, R and other great
tools are way too specialised and techie).
Back to OOo draw: it seems to me that it is just impress without the
effect parts and as such I don't think it uses much space. For the
record I do use it (mostly to do simple drawings, export them as pdf
and insert them into latex document, so I guess I'm not the main
target here...).

I agree with this and I would like to add a few extra points.
OOo Draw is not the best standalone vector drawing tool around, that's
true. On the other hand, it's one of the most accessible for casual
users and it is also the best tool when you use it as part of the OOo
suite, in collaboration with OOo Writer, Impress or Calc. For instance,
I use OOo Draw all the time to produce diagrams that I subsequently
include into OOo Writer documents (that generally end up as Word or PDF
docs). OOo Draw provides the simplest workflow for that type of usage,
which I encounter all the time in business environments.
So when it comes to Shane's statement "it just isnt any good", I'd say
it depends from what point of view. If you are a graphic artist, indeed
you need a more elaborate tool and you probably expect to have to
download such a specialist tool. If you are a business or home user who
just wants to include the occasional drawing into a word processing
document, OOo Draw is exactly what you need. Also note that OOo Draw has
its quirks but once you understand how things work (such as the colour
palette management), it is actually quite good. I first used it under
duress because it was the only tool that supported the workflow I needed
and I had low expectations but I have been pleasantly surprised along
the way.
One last that point I want to make it that removing OOo Draw from the
default install would mean that you would no longer have a vector
drawing tool in the default install (apart from OOo Impress but that
would be misusing it to do a job it's not really designed to do, in the
same way that thousands of Windows users routinely misuse Powerpoint to
include drawings in their documents because they don't have any real
vector drawing package at their disposal).
In conclusion, I think OOo Draw fits well in the Ubuntu application
ecosystem and deserves to be installed by default because it provides
casual users with an adequate drawing package that works out of the box,
is reasonably intuitive to use and integrates well with the rest of the
office suite.

I don't mind installing extra software so removing it would be OK for
me, but only if it does allow a huge space gain, which I doubt (the
size of the .deb isn't a good hint here as impress is tiny and depends
on draw).

I agree to that too. And I think that the benefits of removing it
without crippling Impress are too small compared to the downsides of
doing so (namely: working out how to de-couple it from Impress and not
break anything as well as the reasons detailed above).
Bruno
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Tue, 18 May 2010 21:55:38 +0100
Subject: Re: SRWare Iron: Chromium without the data-mining
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8

http://www.srware.net/en/software_srware_iron_chrome_vs_iron.php
This should become a full open source project with a community behind
it. With Mozilla disregarding H.264, the community needs a full
browser capable of H.264 video playback without the privacy issues of
Chrome.

Unless things have changed, Chromium does not include the tracking
features of the branded Chrome. Hence, Chromium is fine. Plus it has
the benefit of already being a full open source project.

We need to "Iceweasel" Chromium.

Why? Are there distribution restrictions on Chromium? In any event,
Ubuntu distributes Firefox. Maybe talk to Debian?

I'm willing to put the infinityOS team behind this,

So you and one other?

but I would like
the help and support of the Ubuntu community.

To build and package Chromium? That's already being done for Maverick,
and there are PPA channels for Release, Beta and Daily builds.

Thanks,
Ryan

Good luck.
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Tue, 18 May 2010 19:00:52 -0400
Subject: Re: SRWare Iron: Chromium without the data-mining
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 3:33 AM, Jonathon Fernyhough

Unless things have changed, Chromium does not include the tracking
features of the branded Chrome. Hence, Chromium is fine. Plus it has
the benefit of already being a full open source project.

It doesn't include everything, but it does include a lot of it. This
is outlined on the SRWare website. SRWare went through and removed all
of the offending code, so perhaps it would be best if Ubuntu/Debian
went and talked to them about officially packaging SRWare Iron for
inclusion into the Ubuntu and Debian distributions. SRWare Iron has
released source code as well, although it appears to be out of date.

Why? Are there distribution restrictions on Chromium? In any event,
Ubuntu distributes Firefox. Maybe talk to Debian?

I've posted this on the debian-devel mailing list as well. This was
posted out of a concern that Canoncial is thinking about switching
over to Chromium in later releases as Lubuntu has done already. I have
seen articles of this possibility as well. I don't feel making
Chromium the default browser is appropriate until the privacy issues
are addressed. I also feel that taking care these issues before a
switch to Chromium is even seriously considered is beneficial to
everyone.

I'm willing to put the infinityOS team behind this,

So you and one other?

I have a team of about 5 people at the moment. My team is certainly
small, which would prevent us from taking a more central role in such
a project, but we would be more than willing to help package it and
test it.

but I would like
the help and support of the Ubuntu community.

To build and package Chromium? That's already being done for Maverick,
and there are PPA channels for Release, Beta and Daily builds.

As infinityOS is based on the Ubuntu codebase and will stay that way,
whatever benefits Ubuntu will benefit infinityOS as well. As I have
said in prior posts, we intend to give back whatever we take. We have
an obligation to contribute to the Ubuntu community, as infinityOS
would not be possible without its great amount of work.
We would be more than willing to assist in a project to alleviate the
privacy concerns of Chromium.

Good luck.

Thank you,
Ryan
------------------------------

Patrick H.

2010-05-24 03:57:04 UTC

Permalink

Well, chromium is a binary, isn't it.

On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 8:30 PM, Anthony G Weitekamp

------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Tue, 18 May 2010 13:36:19 -0400
Subject: Re: SRWare Iron: Chromium without the data-mining
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 1:27 PM, Shane Fagan

Unless things have changed, Chromium does not include the tracking
features of the branded Chrome. Hence, Chromium is fine. Plus it has
the benefit of already being a full open source project.

We need to "Iceweasel" Chromium.

Why? Are there distribution restrictions on Chromium? In any event,
Ubuntu distributes Firefox. Maybe talk to Debian?

I'm willing to put the infinityOS team behind this,

So you and one other?

but I would like
the help and support of the Ubuntu community.

To build and package Chromium? That's already being done for Maverick,
and there are PPA channels for Release, Beta and Daily builds.

Thanks,
Ryan

Unless things have changed, Chromium does not include the tracking
features of the branded Chrome. Hence, Chromium is fine. Plus it has
the benefit of already being a full open source project.

Why? Are there distribution restrictions on Chromium? In any event,
Ubuntu distributes Firefox. Maybe talk to Debian?

I'm willing to put the infinityOS team behind this,

So you and one other?

but I would like
the help and support of the Ubuntu community.

To build and package Chromium? That's already being done for Maverick,
and there are PPA channels for Release, Beta and Daily builds.

Good luck.

Thank you,
Ryan
------------------------------

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